Board Thread:General Grimm Discussion/@comment-26516813-20151015022913/@comment-26976525-20151024062014

Lurkenfrau wrote:

HowtobeaGrimm wrote:

Lurkenfrau wrote:

HowtobeaGrimm wrote:

... My perspective is that Nick has changed from who he was in season 1. He has gone over the edge. He breaks the law and is now the really dangerous person in Portland. He's working on his own set of personal rules instead of applying the law equally. He's defining that what ever is good for Nick, is what is good for Portland, and that is how a "Godfather" of the mafia acts.

In that regard Nick is now no different from how Renard ran the city before Nick came, i.e. taking bribes from illegal fight promoters in the Wesen community, cutting off the ear of assasins who arrive without Renard's permission. A law unto himself.

Wow. That's really harsh.

You are completely ignoring the fact that the Laws of the Human World do not cover all the circumstances that happen in the Wesen World. They never do. I think you've made my point. Laws apply to Wesen. Laws do not apply to Grimms.

Uh, no I didn't prove your point...and you are ignoring all the questions I asked.

And when did Nick ever take bribes or profit in any way from illegal Wesen activity?

ok, I'll try answering them one by one. Let me know if I miss something.

1) Lawless Wesen can literally get away with murder...2) when there is no way to prosecute them in a Human Court without presenting facts that would reveal their Wesen abilities. 3) There is no 'Wesen Court' in Portland for Nick to turn over lawless Wesen to.

1) The "lawless" can literally get away with murder everyday.  Pick any ethnic, religious, sexual, occupational, territorial group you wish and you can find people who have committed crimes and escaped the punishment of the law.  Wesen are in that regard no different.

2) If you can't present forensic evidence then that's a good argument for not prosecuting them at all. When DNA first became scientifically traceable all sorts of cases were retried because it was found that the scientific facts did not match with eyewitness testimony or assumptions on the part of the prosecutors.

Yes, I would say if you can't prove it by forensic means you don't kill people because they "don't look right to you." Unless of course Nick is infalliable. Is that the message of Grimm, that Nick is a superhuman being who cannot make mistakes or have prejudices or ever be wrong?

3) What authority does the Wesen Council have in democratic American Portland?  Do we give every nationality diplomatic immunity from laws here and send them back to their home countries? Do we have a separate court for the clergy like the ecclesiastes courts of the middle ages. How about certain courts for doctors only judged by other doctors, truck drivers only judged by other truck drivers, Bauerschwein courts to decide on the guilt of Bauerschwein who torch Blutbadin's houses?  Are Wesen people deserving of rights? Or are they not?

What would you suggest Nick do...turn a blind eye to dangerous Wesen who were harming or killing others?

Is that my only choices? Tyranny or anarchy? Either kill all Wesen deemed by Nick's decision to be the "enemy" or do nothing at all? How about arresting the Wesen who are harming or killing others, and let the community decide, i.e. the police, the courts, etc. rather than one man being judge and executionor.

5)  And how many people had Juliette killed?

Granted, some of them were in self defense...but not Kelly, and Juliette was as responsible for her death as the ones who did the deed.

5) If Juliette had been arrested would the Portland courts have convicted her of first degree murder in the case of Kelly Burkhardt? That's the only circumstances which would bring her the death penalty?

Or is it a matter of vengence on Nick's part because Kelly was his mother. Should the victims of the crime be the only ones to pronounce sentence? Mind you, this is the way blood feuds get started. You killed one of mine, so I kill two of yours.

6.  Nick covered up Juliette's other killings...do you think that Nick should have arrested her and let the courts decide?

6.) In a word, Yes.

7) Juliette had threatened to kill Adalind and his child, in a police station, in front of witnesses.

7) OMG it could only have been worse if she had threatened them in a church! Seems to me Nick had plenty of witnesses to get a restraining order on Juliette or we could just preemptorial people who make threats against someone who gets pregnant by their significant other. The floors of the police department would be flooded with blood and there would be many motherless children.

8) Nick knew that Juliette had killed others, so he had reason to believe that she would kill Adalind and the baby too.

8) Well then let's kill everyone who we "know" has a tendency toward murder in their heart. Real crimes are unimportant. Thought crimes are what should be punished.

9)Juliette also used her powers to try to kill Monroe...should he have arrested her for attempted murder?

9) That would have been traditional in a civilized society. But then I forget Monroe is special. He is a god. Attempting to kill him is worse than attempting to kill any other person in the world. If you threaten Nick's friends then you are beyond the pale, you have committed a sin too great for you to receive justice.

You do realize you are giving all the reasons for rule by the tyrant and against rule by law or democracy, or reasoned judgement? You can do that. I mean most people in the world seem to believe that way. You would not be any different in your emotions.